Author Topic: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front  (Read 1662 times)

LWB250

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Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« on: March 21, 2019, 01:21:30 PM »
Because I've been presented with a conundrum relative to equipping my 1965 220SEb with a radio, one of the considerations has been for a stereo model. However, I don't have speakers for the parcel shelf, nor do I really want them.

I was thinking about a way to mount two small speaker in the space where the current dash speaker is, but I suspect that will be difficult at best, not to mention the very, very limited amount of space available for anything to fit in there times two.

I'm curious to know what others might have done in this regard so I can get some differing opinions and experiences to guide me to a suitable solution. I'm not looking for high fidelity nor performance, as the majority of my listening would be radio such as NPR and podcasts from an iPod if I find a capable radio. I also don't want to compromise the integrity of my new dash pad or the restoration work I've completed in this area, either.

Thanks!

Dan

Squiggle Dog

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2019, 02:57:28 PM »
I fit a pair of 4" Boss 200W 4 ohm speakers in the front of a 1965 W111 220S sedan. They didn't exactly fit because they are wider than the original speaker, but I used a rotary tool and cut a section off of the sides of the speakers.


I also had to bend in the tabs to get the clearance I needed.


Once the speakers fit into the opening, I cut out a brace from a thick piece of steel, then drilled and threaded some holes.


The speakers fit nice and snug with the brace in place. I wedged a cloth in where the speakers contacted the body, and used it to keep dust off of the speakers. Since it can be seen through the speaker grille, I made sure it was black.


There was enough clearance for the speaker grille to fit in place.
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1967 W110 230 Universal Wagon Project
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Squiggle Dog

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2019, 03:08:41 PM »
Also, I wired the mono Grundig radio (which has an auxiliary input) in series-parallel (the fronts wired together in series, the rears wired together in series, and the front and rear sets wired together in parallel).


The speakers in back didn't require cutting any large holes; simply drilling four small screw holes per speaker cover.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2019, 03:12:42 PM by Squiggle Dog »
Stop paying for animal enslavement, cruelty, and slaughter. Save your health and the planet. Go vegan! I did 17 years ago. https://challenge22.com/

1967 W110 230 Universal Wagon Project
1980 W116 300SD Turbo Diesel 346,000

LWB250

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2019, 04:36:15 PM »
Nice.

I've been researching this over the last couple of hours, and the approach you took in front is exactly what I want to do. I'm not going to put anything on the parcel shelf. An alternative is speakers on the kick panels, but those are so obtrusive and potentially non-original unless you get the retro ones that a few vendors are offering.

Now all I need to do is figure out what I'm going to to do regarding the radio....

Thanks!

Dan

Bidart39

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2019, 06:55:59 PM »
I haven't heard of original the speakers on the kick panels, they seem pretty cool! What I did with my radio was I sent it to a radio repair place that kept the original housing and face plate but put modern internals. The internals are from Aurora design: http://www.tech-retro.com/Aurora_Design/Home.html. They have a list of recommended shops to have this installed. I went for the non-bluetooth option and ended up paying about 400$, which is close to a Retrosound radio, but much better in my opinion. You can keep the original look, but have 4X45W output and a 3.5mm jack input.

Scoot

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2019, 07:43:44 PM »
Now all I need to do is figure out what I'm going to to do regarding the radio....
You are really stuck if you want an in-dash stereo unit in a Fintail.  Nothing really exists designed to fit the hole, and if you modify a later big-face Becker to become a small-face Becker, at a minimum you lose the tone arm.  Maybe that's not so important.  We did take a Europa Stereo and couple it with a Pioneer amp (200 watts I think) using an adapter cable that was on eBay.  That's in our 73 Alfa GTV but the same would apply to a Fintail. 

If it were me and I wanted good audio sound, I would probably go with a remote stereo in the car and hide the speakers as best as I could.  Or I would go with a Europa TR in-dash and accept the sound quality in the center dash speaker (which isn't bad!) as being what it is.
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LWB250

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2019, 07:58:05 PM »
I've seen where companies are doing this - basically gutting a vintage radio and installing modern internals. That would be great if I had a faceplate for one of the radios I currently own. The cost of a faceplate and mounting brackets/hardware are stupid expensive, easily $150 or more. I have a Europa TG and the dash speaker, so dropping another $150 with Eddie and Tom at Becker would do it, but I would have nearly $400 invested in a vintage (original) radio that hasn't been rebuilt.

I don't care about stereo or modern conveniences, I would be happy to be able to listen to my local NPR station and that's all.

I hate to admit it, but I've been looking closely at the RetroSound radios. The one with the Becker style faceplate and black buttons would be near perfect if it wasn't for the awful display. That sort of blows the whole effect. Granted, they do have overlays that mimic a tuning scale, but I haven't quite figured out what's going on with this approach - do you just look at the display through the tuning scale when the radio is on?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/201832326183?ViewItem=&item=201832326183&ssPageName=ADME:X:COCE:US:3160

This approach is a real affront to my purist conventions, but I've gotten to the point where I've got to invest a significant amount of money just to get a working vintage radio, more than if I went retro aftermarket. This direction would give me all the modern goodies to go along with it, but I'm not sure I could stomach the non-original look.

I'm really torn at this point. Sigh.

Keep those ideas coming, folks! They are a big help.

Dan

tram

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2019, 10:20:51 PM »
Now all I need to do is figure out what I'm going to to do regarding the radio....
You are really stuck if you want an in-dash stereo unit in a Fintail.  Nothing really exists designed to fit the hole, and if you modify a later big-face Becker to become a small-face Becker, at a minimum you lose the tone arm.  Maybe that's not so important.  We did take a Europa Stereo and couple it with a Pioneer amp (200 watts I think) using an adapter cable that was on eBay.  That's in our 73 Alfa GTV but the same would apply to a Fintail. 

If it were me and I wanted good audio sound, I would probably go with a remote stereo in the car and hide the speakers as best as I could.  Or I would go with a Europa TR in-dash and accept the sound quality in the center dash speaker (which isn't bad!) as being what it is.

Becker did make a thin face stereo for the 1970-71 W111 Cabriolets and Coupes. Damn expensive though! I have one I'm installing in a customer's 3,5.

If you want early rear deck speakers... check these out:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Lautsprecherbox-mit-Lautsprecher-fur-Mercedes-Benz-300-A-B-C-D-S-SC/303052730729

These are what I'll be using in my 3,5 300SE tribute built from a 1965 220SEb sunroof sedan along with the Becker thinline stereo and an underdash Philips Automignon 45 RPM player and vintage car phone:



Burled walnut all around including the steering wheel, black on red leather, rear bucket seat option... big ballin'. 8)

Really looking forward to this project since I'll never find/ be able to afford a real W112 sedan.

I'm getting off topic a little but I was quite excited to find those NICE reproduction rear deck speakers! Very authentic and they sound great. Squiggle's solution looks quite good also.
Life is sexually transmitted and fatal... so who needs airbags* and ABS?

*W112 excepted

fitts07

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #8 on: March 22, 2019, 06:42:23 AM »
I went with a Retrosound Laguna. It has bluetooth. I also bought a dual voice coil from retrosound that is for a w108 and i put in the dash. Sounds good. I removed the speakers that a previous owner installed in the rear deck, i thought they looked bad. 

Its what non-car people dont get. They see all cars as just two tons of wires, glass, metal and rubber. That's all they see. People like you or I know, we have an unshakable belief that cars are living entities. You can develop a relationship with a car, and thats just what non-car people don't get.

LWB250

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2019, 07:40:04 AM »
I like this.

Did you have any issues with getting the speaker to fit?

This would be the perfect setup.

Thanks!

Dan

fitts07

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2019, 09:32:28 AM »
Apparently the w110/w111 sedan has a narrower speaker slot than the w108. It fits, its just a little funky. I can post a picture later tonight when i get off work, cant have my phone.
Its what non-car people dont get. They see all cars as just two tons of wires, glass, metal and rubber. That's all they see. People like you or I know, we have an unshakable belief that cars are living entities. You can develop a relationship with a car, and thats just what non-car people don't get.

LWB250

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2019, 11:42:26 AM »
Apparently the w110/w111 sedan has a narrower speaker slot than the w108. It fits, its just a little funky. I can post a picture later tonight when i get off work, cant have my phone.

True. The W110/W111 has an approximately 2” x 8” speaker, I believe.

Would love to see pictures, thanks! Definitely a pricey thing, looks like they’re over $100, but there’s nothing else like it on the market and it’s certaimly a niche product.

Dan

Scoot

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2019, 03:13:21 PM »
What a way to spoil the dash of a beautiful car.

Might I suggest a radio delete plate and a remote radio somewhere?
1965 300SE Lang
1959 Borgward Isabella Coupé

LWB250

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #13 on: March 24, 2019, 04:26:10 PM »
What a way to spoil the dash of a beautiful car.

Might I suggest a radio delete plate and a remote radio somewhere?

Haven't priced delete plates lately, have you?   ;D

Last one I saw for my car was selling for $220.00.

Dan

Scoot

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Re: Approach to Adding Stereo Speakers in Front
« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2019, 09:38:28 AM »
Haven't priced delete plates lately, have you?   ;D
Last one I saw for my car was selling for $220.00.
I would happily spend $220 to have a dash that looked right.   I would also spend $400 on a radio if that's what it took.  It really depends on whether or not you car about it looking "right".  If you don't, shove in a retrosound.  if you do, find a more attractive solution. 

I really hate looking at an otherwise great and original car, and then seeing what is hanging out of the center of the dash...
1965 300SE Lang
1959 Borgward Isabella Coupé